#22 - The Value of a Mirror and Being a Student of Life with Elise Buie

Chelsea Williams sits down with a special guest, Elise Buie, to explore the intersection of financial management, business ownership, and parenting. They dive deep into the complexities of balancing professional success with personal joy, and how setting boundaries can help carve out space for what truly matters. This conversation is all about prioritizing your time, staying true to your values, and embracing the power of decisiveness in both business and life.

Key Highlights: 

1. How societal expectations shape our financial and personal choices, and the importance of setting boundaries. 
2. The liberating feeling of focusing on your highest and best use of time. 
3. Why personal well-being should always be at the top of your priority list. 
4. The power of being a lifelong student in both business and life. 
5. How taking control of your time and attention can lead to greater freedom and fulfillment. 

Tune in for a conversation that will challenge the way you approach business, parenting, and the balance between the two.

Elise Buie is the founder of Elise Buie Family Law, specializing in family law, particularly high-conflict divorce and dependency matters. Elise is dedicated to advocating for families, especially children, during difficult transitions. She brings extensive experience in complex parenting cases and offers personalized, civility-focused legal services. Elise is highly active in various bar associations and her team is available 24/7 to support clients, especially during crises.

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Always and Never About Money Episode Links:
Video Podcast: https://www.youtube.com/@MoneyMasteryWithChelsea
Socials: https://linktr.ee/the_money_whisper
Money Mastery Website: www.moneymastery.work
Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/AlwaysandNeverMoney/

Transcript

Speaker 1
Welcome to Always and Never About the Money. Are you ready to embark on a journey that will forever change the way you perceive money? We'll get ready because we're about to dive deep into the fascinating world of finances and human behavior. 

I'm your host, Chelsea Williams and Money Whisperer. I'm here to help you realize what your money story is telling you and how you can change it. But hold on tight because this is not the dull black and white talk about money. We're gonna splash all the color into this typical nap inducing conversation on Always and Never About the Money. We're gonna explore the intricate relationship between money and our daily lives from the impact history has left on us, and how we still manage it. How your habits shape your money, and what beliefs are driving your habits, choices, and relationships to the deeper values and emotions we've come to attach to it. 

We are going to unravel it all through insightful conversation and personal anecdotes. We'll bring you the expert insights, real life stories and meaningful thought provoking ideas that will inspire you, educate you, and initiate some serious perspective change when it comes to your money. Remember, money is just a tool. Together we'll untangle the web of emotions, beliefs, and values. We've come to attach to it and find a new perspective on how it can enhance our lives. So whether you're looking for motivation, practical advice, or a good laugh always and never about, the money's got you covered. Thank you for joining us in this transformative journey. 

Get ready to challenge your beliefs and embark on a financial exploration like no other. Without further ado, let's kick off the episode of Always and Never About the Money. Okay. First of all, is your house okay from the hurricane? I feel like everybody's hearing about Florida, but nobody's talking about like Louisiana, Alabama, all of those. 

Speaker 2
Oh no, totally fine. We had no bad weather whatsoever. 

Speaker 1
Oh, okay. Cool. Yeah. 'cause that did a lot of damage. It's pretty tragic. Oh, 

Speaker 2
It's wild. Wild, yes. Yeah. 

Speaker 1
Awesome. 

Speaker 2
I mean, the storms that have happened have just been awful. My supervising attorney lives in Florida, so she's been gone all week and you know, doing all kinds of, you know, first the prep and then now the cleanup and the, but yeah, it's been a lot. 

Speaker 1
Yeah, it's a process and unexpected things like that that cause like major life shifts. 

Speaker 2
Oh, I mean, you just met from a business perspective, can you imagine these firms that have been hit by both of these storms back to back? Like they literally could have just lost almost a month of revenue 

Speaker 1
And everything. Yes. Yeah. Not to mention the revenue that they're gonna lose while they're focusing on just rebuilding. 

Speaker 2
Right. 

Speaker 1
And catching up. It's amazing. 

Speaker 2
It is. 

Speaker 1
And that ties into, I think one of the things that we could really kick this off with is, like, I always say, and I truly believe to my deepest core that being a business owner will challenge you in every single way. And you will only ever grow your business as much as you are willing to look in the mirror and grow yourself. 

Speaker 2
I mean, you, you will get zero disagreement from me. And it is, it's exhausting. 

Speaker 1
It is exhausting 

Speaker 2
Because there are days that I'm like, yeah, I'm not in the mood to grow today. Like, I want to curl up in my bed and cry, not grow. Do you know? Oh 

Speaker 1
Gosh, yes. Those seasons because like, we're human too and, and, but we're always in the leadership position and so we always have this unspoken expectation and it's like when I have something going on in my personal life, like my teenager right now, shout out to your Facebook post. Because I felt that like, personally, I wanna do the same thing. Like, I just wanna be depressed for Yeah. Let a week to be depressed and then I'll be back. 

Speaker 2
Right. And there is none of that. I mean, and it's kind of, I find it so lonely because you can't really share even that with many people. Do you know what I mean? Like anybody on your team, your, I mean, 'cause they, your shoulders need to be the big ones where you're handling whatever's going on and all the stuff they're dealing with. And you know, I mean, yeah. Like, I find it really, really exhausting. If I'm just gonna be bluntly honest about the level of responsibility that is on your shoulders as an owner is mind boggling. And as a mom too, like I felt like, okay, my kids are getting outta the house Q and it's like, yeah, no, now their problems are even bigger in their early twenties. It's like life big stuff. 

You're like, oh damn, we're gonna talk about that now. And then you are dealing with your work stuff and it's like, okay, let me deal with 45 people's, you know, issues 

Speaker 1
Everything. Yes. So how do you, how do you manage that? Like what are some things that you do to help even a little bit with those moments? 

Speaker 2
I see a counselor, I, I'm, I'm being really honest, but I think that I find a counselor very helpful, you know, to just like, help me understand how do I stay in my lane? How do I make sure I have good boundaries? How do I, I mean, one thing she's really helped me with is, 'cause I sometimes, and I'm sure you feel the same thing, we probably all just use a different vocabulary, but I feel like my box starts overflowing sometimes. Like my ability to just shove things down and be like, okay, I'll deal with that later. I'll compartmentalize this. And you know, you have enough trauma that goes on in your life as we all do. Whether it's, you know, losing a loved one or dealing with some horrible thing with one of your children that's, you know, kind of just really heart wrenching or just all the things that can happen watching these storms for days and worried about, you know, people. 

And I mean, there's just a lot that goes on. And so sometimes my box overflows and it really, I can't stuff it down anymore. And I'm like, oh my, I am not now doing well because it's like, where is my room to stuff? And so I have found a counselor to be very helpful in teaching me how, like, literally my box is only so big. Like I can, you know, stuff some things here and there. But she really helps me to understand like, okay, now is I'm in a season that I must take things outta my box and put them somewhere else. I I have to like, you know, share or I have to decide, okay, this is gonna go over here in the garage and it's gonna sit here for six months because I, I truly don't have the bandwidth to deal with this right now. 

You know? And so, I mean, I have this very visual idea of my box and I'll sometimes be like, oh, okay, I'm gonna have to pull this out and set this over here because my box is getting too full and, and I can really see if my box gets too full. You know, I just will not be resilient when I'm dealing with all the things. 'cause you know, all the things are gonna happen whether I'm in a resilient mode or not. The things keep coming. And so I just have to, when I find myself just either, you know, just not being able to be my best self when things are coming, I'm like, oh, my box must be getting kind of full. And so I need to unpack and get it a little figured out so that I can do better. 

And I do find a counselor is very helpful. 

I've worked with a coach. I also just really am crazy about my time. I mean, like I, every single thing goes on my calendar. I am like a crazy woman. Like if it is not on my calendar, it is not happening. So do not think I'm doing it. Do not have any idea that I am looking at it because it must be on my calendar. And there's only so much time that is there. And so if that time gets taken up and people are like, oh Elise, I need you to do this. I'm like, well if, is there time on my calendar? They're like, no. And I'm like, well then that's a problem because I cannot make more time. And like I'm not gonna, I had somebody ask me the other day, they're like, can I take your afternoon walk? 

And I'm like, Nope. Can I 

Speaker 1
Delegate exercise money? 

Speaker 2
I'm like, that's not up for grabs. Like, you know, but really just having to be kind of crazy with my boundaries. And then I'm like, you know, if y'all wanna look at my calendar and you wanna delegate things 'cause you are thinking this is a higher priority, I mean, go to it. But it's gotta be within those bounds of what's in there. And I put on my important stuff first. I mean my, my walk, my going to Pilates, my spending time with my husband, my phone calls with my children, you know, whatever that is that I want to prioritize goes on that calendar first. And it's not up for grabs. 

Speaker 1
That goes back to it feeling so lonely. So I don't know about you, but I experience people in relationships outside of work that jokingly, but you know, behind sarcasm, there's always a hint of truth, right? They're like, what do I have to do? Put time on your calendar. Like even my kids or my family, like, do I have to schedule time on your calendar with you? And it can make you feel guilty, number one. And just lonely. Because a lot of people don't really understand that or do that. And you know, to be in a position of a business owner and managing people, you have to, so it's like a double edged sword. 

Speaker 2
I mean, literally just now, right before I got on this zoom, I have a daughter texting me, mom, I really need to talk to you about something I need some time today. I don't usually ask you for same daytime. I mean, literally this is what, and I mean, she's an adult, you know, she's in law school, she's an adult, but she knows that, I mean, how busy I am and how booked I am. But she also, I told her I had an hour and a half, I was like, I have this time. If you need different time, tell me and I'll re reschedule things. You know, she knows that I will meet her needs when she has them. But at the same time, yeah, you do have to ask to get my calendar, you know, because it's not like I'm sitting around on any given day with just like free time waiting to answer an unscheduled call. 

That's just not my life. 

Speaker 1
No. And like I, I'm one where I like both, I, I like structure, but then in a structured systematic way, I'll create room to not be structured like totally 

Speaker 2
Me too. 

Speaker 1
For example, not scheduling anything on a weekend at all. And then just being like a normal person. Like, oh hey, this festival's going on. You wanna come? Yeah, last minute. Yes, I would love, 

Speaker 2
Yeah, exactly. I was telling somebody that I consult with the other day that I actually schedule out of office time during the weeks. Like I pick several little blocks in a month and it'll just say a lease out of office. And that is for me to do what I wanna do in the sense of like, what if I wanna just pick up the phone and call all six kids in a row and decide that I'm just, you know, gonna talk to all my kids at that time randomly, or I wanna go out to lunch or whatever. And I don't put any structure on that, but that time gets scheduled on the calendar, you know, that out of office so that my office knows like, Elise is not available during these hours. 

You know, they don't know what I'm doing. Neither do I. But 

Speaker 1
That's the point. 

Speaker 2
Exactly. It is the point. And sometimes I do end up putting work on it. Like, I might sit down with a forecast and like dig into numbers for three hours, happy as a clam, but nobody's gonna interrupt me. You know? Like I can do what I want and really think. So I do think I'm just like you, I love structure and I love freedom. 

So I have to though calendar my freedom. 

Speaker 1
Yeah. Yeah. And I can imagine like listening to this conversation, even for the people that don't own businesses, they're like, why the heck would you do all of that? Right? And I think that I, I love the word boundaries and, and boundaries. Not just with time, but with people. And yes, this is a lot of work. Most people just simply put, can't cut it, won't figure it out, can't do it. But I think that, I know that what keeps people going is the why. And like, I'm the same too. If I have free time, I'll work on the business just because I, I love it. I love working on my business and I had to proactively set aside non-business time to, to strike that healthy balance. 

Totally. 

Speaker 2
So 

Speaker 1
What is, what is your why? 

Speaker 2
Well, it's interesting you asked that. I mean, I would say I'm in a period of exploration around that. 'cause my Y initially was very much my children. I mean, I did this to literally send them all to private schools, send them all to college. I mean, you know, we had a blended family of six. It was a lot to figure out. And I had my four and, and my ex was not participatory in the financial aspect of raising these four. So I was very much like, ooh, I got four college tuitions. You know, literally absolutely right on the precipice of what I, you know, did. So I mean, I started the firm in 2015 and the first one went off to college in 2015. So it was, you know, it was a wild adventure of being able to do that. And now that all that is done, the kids are all, you know, out of school. 

And now I really have been spending a lot of time thinking about, I mean obviously there's retirement I have to deal with, you know, because I was just kind of nose to the grindstone doing everything for my kids, which I think a lot of moms, single moms, you know, it's a thing. And, and so retirement is a big thing I think about now. But I also, I, I mean, you know, there's a part of me that really, really wants to get more involved in the real thing that I care about, which is how do we take life as a lawyer and actually make it joyful? I mean, 'cause it is an honorable profession. 

I think I feel such privilege and honor to be an attorney. I feel like in a democratic society, you get all this privilege as an attorney and we have to like cherish that, protect it. 

But we have to protect lawyers from just utter burnout and just horrible things where, you know, so many lawyers have substance abuse problems, major mental health issues. So I mean, I run my firm with a real eye towards, you know, how can I bring better life work integration to my team? I mean, we have all kinds of little things we do. And we're now moving to a 30 is the new 40. So our firm is gonna be operated on a 30 hour a week full-time week model, which is, you know, we are definitely out there doing that. And we are beta testing it and doing all the things we need to do to make it work, to be able to roll it out fully in January. 

And so that is my why right now is, you know, really trying to do the best I can as an owner to provide as much life work integration as I can for my team so that my team can then provide our clients with the very best service possible because they are coming from a place of wholeness, not just brokenness. 

Speaker 1
I can appreciate that so much. And I, I kind of have a, the similar story where like, my why started because I got pregnant in 20 and had nothing and nobody, right. I had to, I had to do something. Yep. 

Speaker 2
Right. 

Speaker 1
And that's, that's actually why my first business chose the legal space. 'cause at first people were like, oh, go after attorneys. They make great money so you can make great money. And I'm like, oh, they're jerks. I don't wanna work with attorneys. Right, right. And it kept eating at me and I started doing research and I'm like, wait a minute. Nobody is thinking about how it must feel from the other side of the table. Like, you think about it, nobody, in very few cases, people run to lawyers because they're in a happy go-lucky place in life. 

Speaker 2
No, usually 

Speaker 1
It's like, it's detrimental. Like my life is falling apart. I'm very emotional and I'm like spewing it out. And the piece of information that got my heartstrings attached to serve law firms, 'cause I have to have passion, I cannot do anything without passion, was the fact that it is one of the leading industries industries in mental ailments like depression and suicide and anxiety. And nobody thinks about that. And I think that the fact that you are showing up in the space and you're a trendsetter in the legal space. Like, look, everybody sees Elise Boo and they're like, oh my gosh, Elise. 

And you know, she's doing all these things and it's amazing and, and they look up to you and they're so inspired by you is because you are putting these things first, not only in the space, but with your team because they deserve that. They, they deserve that change and they deserve to like what they do because you're right, it is incredibly honorable. Like these are the people that have the power to change the laws, which need changing, like they are shaping our laws. And that's huge. 

Speaker 2
Huge. 

Speaker 1
Yeah. And the fact that it speaks to like your why is allowed to change. Yeah. Like at first it was for our kids, right? Like for my daughter, to be completely honest, I didn't have the will to live or care right before I found out that I was gonna be a mom. And then my why was her 

Speaker 2
Completely. 

Speaker 1
And then it evolved into well wait one day. She's not like, that's literally my job as a parent is to make sure that you function without me. Right? Like someday I'm gonna need something outside of myself. Right? Yeah. And the fact that you've been able to pivot that and recognize like your y doesn't have to be the same. And it's always gonna be changing. 

Speaker 2
It does. And I, like you feel the same way about having a passion about something like it. I, if I get bored and I find myself like in a ho-hum way, well you can just rest assured that I will create all kinds of chaos because I am just like, yeah, that's not gonna work. Like I cannot do the ho hum. I'm just gonna do this day after day, but I don't really care. And it doesn't have any meaning to me. Like, I mean, I wanna talk to my team. I wanna hear like what their pain points are and what can I do to help them. I mean, I have this whole idea, I'm, you know, clearly I have no idea if it actually works exactly. But this whole idea that if I just pour into my team as much as I can, then they can pour into our clients and then our clients can pour into their children. 

So I literally feel like this is like my way of helping these children of divorce who are in my realm, you know, so that their parents can show up as their best selves and they can be, you know, going through this process, which in so many ways can be so traumatic for people. And I want it to be transformational, not traumatic, you know? And so I really try to do that. And I mean, no doubt I fall short in all kinds of ways, but that, that's what keeps me coming, you know? 'cause I get to like learn and figure out, okay, what did I do wrong? And turn that mirror on myself and try to fix it again and tweak and look at our data. And you know, to me it's a big, like, major problem. 

We're always solving. 

Speaker 1
I like what you just said, being able to, to look in the mirror, which I think is what a lot of people are scared of. And being in the position that I'm in, I get to see like the behind the curtain of businesses. And I can tell you that my business owners that have the mindset that you do of, I want to pour into my team, they are the successful ones. And to go back to the idea that being a business owner will stretch you and find all of your limits and challenge every single one of your growth areas. And I would venture to say that the law firm owners that we work with, that have a team, that experience like turnover, high turnover, it is a relationship communication issue. 

And I would also go as so far as to say, I bet you that those relationship patterns are showing up in their personal lives as well, 

Speaker 2
Right? Oh yeah. Isn't, I mean, it is. I think the people part of this gig is by far the hardest part. And it is by far the part that both kind of tears me up sometimes. You know, where there are times where you work with somebody and you feel like you do everything you're supposed to do. You know, you provide clear expectations, you provide reasonable expectations, you have good communication. You know, you have those coaching conversations. When things go wrong, you circle back around like you really are doing the things and then something happens. Like either they leave or you find out that, you know, they're really not doing what they're supposed to be doing. 

And so maybe you have to let somebody go. You know? And those are so hard. And, but I find those are the ones that stretch me so much because it's literally like, okay, Elise, pull out your mirror and let's go for the full length mirror because let's figure out you, where, where really did we go wrong? 

Like, are you truly walking your talk? Do you know what I mean? Like, are you really doing exactly what you say in so much of the time? You know? 'cause we do have like a leadership team in between me and the, the rest of the team. But so a lot of times it's like, well Elise, did you hold this person accountable for this? And do you know what I mean? I'm constantly finding and I'm like, yeah, maybe I didn't do that so well. So, you know, then you're like, okay, here we are, lesson number 2 million in one. Like, I mean, I sometimes feel like I am like the densest person on the planet. I'm just like, okay, I'm still learning. 

And you know, at some point it's like, shouldn't I be able to just be like, okay, I got this, but I I have yet to say I got this. I mean, literally with anything in this ownership, I mean, I'm gonna take that back. One thing I got, I can forecast like a mother down to the dollar. I mean, we had a situation the other day, I mean, it was hilarious. My accountant called me and said, Elise, you know, you don't owe a dime in taxes. You actually paid estimated taxes to the dollar of what you owed. And I was like, girl. I'm like, no, that is good. That 

Speaker 1
Is impressive. 

Speaker 2
Was it? But that's literally the only thing I got. I can forecast like none other, but the rest I'm just like learning on the fly constantly. 

Speaker 1
Yeah. I think something, I think a mindset that I took on a long time ago that has and continues to serve me and, and this is for business ownership or life in general, is that I have accepted that I am forever a student. 

Speaker 2
Oh yeah. 

Speaker 1
Forever a student of, of life in learning new concepts. In applying them in relationships. 

Speaker 2
Yep. 

Speaker 1
In communication. It like, I, I I mean is there, is there truly any figuring it out? Like math is great. That's why I love it. They're so black and white, like numbers don't care about your feelings. They don't care Exactly. Going on with your life. They're completely predictable in most cases, which is why I have comfort in them. But then there's the other side of numbers, which is the story 

Speaker 2
Yep. 

Speaker 1
That it tells me, right? Like, I love spending time with numbers and they tell me a really awesome story. But then like the other side of it is meeting the person behind the numbers and hearing their story and learning how to reconcile the two, and then coaching them basically to like, get in alignment with your numbers. Let's get you both in the same book on the same chapter with a purpose of this book. 

Speaker 2
Yes, indeed. I love that. We actually call it in our firm numbers plus narrative. And so we, we literally seek out, you know, 'cause we track a lot of data. I mean, I'm kind of a data 'cause I do love numbers. Like they, I think, like you just said, I don't have to deal with feelings, then I can just deal with numbers. But I always say we have to have the narrative, like the numbers only tell part of the story, you know? And so it's like we have the numbers and then we have to seek the narrative and figure out what is going on, you know, what's happening with the person and Yeah. It's a, it's a wild, a wild ride of learning. 

I think you're exactly right though, to think about that as a lifelong student of everything. Like we truly, there is no such thing as, I got this, like, it's kind of like laundry. 

I thought this when I was raising my kids. I never, ever, ever got to the bottom of the laundry pile ever. Like I had swimmers, they would literally, I mean just towels galore. I was always just like, I mean, I felt like it was this crazy thing and my kids were a big part of doing the laundry, so it wasn't all on me. But I remember one time I got to no laundry on the floor of the laundry room and my son walked in with such a smirk and literally just dropped dirty socks. I mean my literally, my, my no laundry did not even last like a full minute. And I was just like, there's really no end to this at all. 

And I think that's the same, I think it is the same with learning. Like it's constant. It's lucky. We like love learning. I mean that's, this could be really painful otherwise. 

Speaker 1
Yeah, it would be. Yeah. And so embracing that, and even when I do feel like, like with my kids especially, we will reach a point to where I'm like, sweet, we're in this awesome flow. We have a good relationship. And then like puberty hits and I'm like, holy shit. Like what just happened? Who are you? Where's my kid? And what do I do in all of this? Like, where are my boundaries 

Speaker 2
Completely? Well, and there is no good teaching. I have to tell you. Like I've, and I've gone through a lot now. I mean, I have 10 kids, I mean six kids between like 22 and 32. So I mean, you know, they're grown humans. But we are in a whole new phase, even now as these young adult people. Like, I'm having to learn to navigate kind of like this daughter who reaches out. Like I will literally ask her like, is this a conversation where you actually want my input and advice? Or do you want me just to be quiet and you are gonna just tell me whatever? And you don't want any, you know, you don't want any input and advice. 

You just need me to listen. But you know what I mean, really navigating that. Because I mean, it's tough when you're dealing with young adults because it is different and, and they're very different. And they literally, I mean, it's like a, a day by day game call. Like what are, what kind of relationship are we in? You know? Like, am I, am I the silent, you know, Mona Lisa, mom right now? Or do you actually wanna hear my opinion? Or do you just want me to nod along and be like, you've got this, you know, like, check in with you later. 

Speaker 1
Oh my goodness. And it's like that compartmentalizing that you're talking about. Like one minute we can be the leader and managing a team and like the business is doing amazing. And then one phone call and it's like, I don't know how to speak teenager. Like, I'm convinced that I don't speak teenager, I don't get it. I don't do drama. All I can listen, I'm a great listener, but the feedback isn't risk. It's like it's no win-win. So it's like, okay, I'm just gonna exist right now and, and just be present. I feel like that's all I've got. 

Like I don't, I don't have any other tools in this right now. And so to flip from like one role to the other, I think one of the things that, that we are forever learning too is like the emotional intelligence and the emotional, like regulating oh, our emotions from minute to minute. 

Speaker 2
I mean, I, I felt like raising teenagers was the biggest life lesson on me becoming this me, you know, like, I was like, I cannot ride these waves with, I mean, you know, you have six of them around that is a lot of waves happening. Like, and I was like, we, this ship is going all crazy if I start riding these waves. So I mean, I became like the most steady Eddie regulated. I mean, my children would tell you robotic. They could tell me the wildest stuff and I'd be like, oh, well that's interesting. How do you feel about that? You know? I mean, and they would be like, mom, do you not have a bigger reaction? 

And I'm like, I don't think a big reaction is gonna be helpful, do you? And they were, 

Speaker 1
It's not the right one. Yeah. Is Lucy No, that's funny. I saw a post, like, I have one teenager, so hats off to you completely. 

But I saw this post like where one kid is one kid, two kids are four, anything above three kids, and you have 2,670 kids. Like, it just never ends. It's so true. 

Speaker 2
It's so true. Yeah. And I think though learning that to where I felt like I had this little I area where I could go up and down, but just a little bit, you know? And, and, but the rest, they really needed me to not ride those teenage things, you know? And I do think it was helpful though, for this business ownership thing because the same thing, you know, in our businesses, I find people could take you on a big ride and it's like, yeah, I'm not, I can't go there. Like, y'all need me to be steady. You need me to respond calmly and logically and, you know, with reason. 

But yeah, it's a lot though. You feel, I think a lot of responsibility. There are times I wanna break out of my little thing and just like be a little, you know, go a little wackadoodle. And I mean, Doug probably gets a little bit of that, you know, where I'm just like 

Speaker 1
Relief. Yeah. 

Speaker 2
You know, like, okay. But I mean, you don't really get to do that much. Do you know, because Yeah. 

Speaker 1
And, and we have to have somewhere to go Yeah. With all of that, right? Like, I have a couple of friends, especially, I'll just, like you said, I'll call 'em up and be like, look girl, I just need to bitch and I need you to not say any, I just need to vent. I need to act crazy, sound crazy, talk crazy, and then just forget it all happened. I'll be fine. Like, right. Like we just, we need that. And so to be a high achieving anything, owning a business or not, you, you have to find that balance. And you have to look in the mirror and recognize your own thought patterns and your own actions and your own flags of like, oh yeah. 

When we need to do the things. And again, like, I love your word boundaries and, and like boundaries piss people off. I don't know about you, but like in my life, people don't like my boundaries. 

Speaker 2
Yep. 

Speaker 1
Like, 

Speaker 2
But I don't care. 

Speaker 1
Thank you. Thank you. Because the ironic thing is to achieve anything great in this life, and especially as mothers, because we're conditioned historically. And to be the, to be everything, to do, to be the word, to sacrifice ourselves and to take any piece of ourselves back is seen as selfish, self-centered, arrogant. You're neglect like just all the shameful things. 

Speaker 2
I mean like a neglectful mom. It just is wild. The thing I'm like, whoa, okay. Yeah, yeah, 

Speaker 1
Yeah. For sure. And so it, and so I think what you and I have accepted it sounds like, is like we have to put ourselves first. And the best analogy I've ever heard for that is you cannot pour from an empty cup. Cup, right? Like, you can't, like even for the mothers that are listening right now, you want to do, you are doing like we, I need you to hear, you cannot show up as your best if you don't put yourself first. And I don't care if that is meditation, sitting on the back porch, going to the gym, going on a vacation with your besties for a week. Like whatever that is, we have to take care of ourselves first. 

And that's really hard as a woman and mother. 

Speaker 2
Oh, I think our society has made it almost impossible where, I mean, we have to become so strong against societal norms of what is expected. I mean, I was actually on a zoom this morning and people were talking about picture day. And I literally, I was like, I was the worst mom ever. I never knew when picture day was ever. Like I swear I was not involved in picture day. My kids probably showed up to every picture day in the most absurd, mismatched, ridiculous outfits. 'cause I can assure you, my boys surely didn't know when it was, was picture day, nor did they care. And my daughter is just not that type. 

I mean, so we were just probably the most clueless picture day family known to mankind. But I I, I couldn't, I can't do it all. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you are gonna survive if your school picture is not the most perfect, you know, portrait of all times. And if you care, figure it out. Figure out when picture day is and get yourself dressed like you wanna dress and more power to you. I'm not gonna stop you, but I'm also not gonna be there spending an entire morning figure out my kids' outfits. And when I listen to this stuff, I'm just like, oh my gosh. Like what? This is what we're supposed to do now for a kid to take a picture. 

Speaker 1
You're making me feel so much better as a mom right now. Seriously. Like I ignore the weekly emails unless somebody, if, unless it's bad enough that somebody's reaching out to me, I don't know about it. 

Speaker 2
Exactly. 

Well, I mean, I delegated my kids all their school communication to my executive assistant person that I had who was a VA kind of person. And they read all the emails they would send, like when it was like, you know, come deliver this stuff for the auction. I didn't know. She'd be like, okay, I delivered this and I'd get a thank you note. I'm like, how nice of us to do that. I was like, thanks Sandra. I mean literally I was like, just handle that. Like, I, I mean imagine there were as we had here with six kids in six different schools. 'cause you know, we were that family that did not think, you know, your child could get this exact same education because they are all different learners. But you know, there was no way I was keeping up with all that. 

No way. 

Speaker 1
Oh my gosh. Same one of the, one of the more recent hires that I made in my business was a personal executive assistant for myself. And let me tell you, because I feel guilty sometimes still about, oh well you should be doing that and nobody should be managing your kids' calendar. That's irresponsible. You're an unloving mother. Right. I finally did it and Elise let, like the piece that I experienced every day when I opened my inbox and there's only eight emails instead of 88 emails. And the fact that I can, I literally took a picture. Me and my son were walking downtown and he loves Pokemon. 

Well apparently last week, as of last week, he doesn't anymore. But at the time he's like, mom, I'm old. I'm too old for Pokemon. But at the time he loved Pokemon and I saw this poster on the wall of a Pokemon convention and I took a picture of it and I sent it to my VA and I said, put it on my calendar. 

Yeah. And it was on my calendar. And the same thing with my daughter's soccer schedule. I was like, can you put her practices and her games on my calendar? And like, here is how serving yourself serves your kids and other people around you. I either would have forgotten or it would've caused so much stress and taken away literally my time to go and figure out how to log in and add it to my calendar. And instead of all of that, I'm able to just show up. Exactly. And the game or plan for the post happy extension. 

Speaker 2
Yeah. Isn't that wild? I mean, actually spend the time, you know, doing the thing that matters. The kids don't care how the the thing gets on your calendar, I can assure you. But they do care if you show up. I mean, we had a year with all these boys playing football. I mean, it's kind of embarrassing. But we would go to a Friday night football game in Seattle, then we would get on a red eye at the airport. We would drive to SeaTac, get on a red eye, fly to Chicago. 'cause I had a kid in college playing there. And we'd go to his Saturday football games. I mean, and it was this whole thing. 

And I mean, my assistant handled all of it. Like I would literally get a note that would say, Elise Ethan's game is at this location. Here's the link. It is at this time. Your flight is this number at this time and Eric's game is this location and this time. I mean, but do you know how much work went into all that? Like I, I couldn't do it, but I could show up if somebody like could help me and I could get to these games in different parts of the country back to back days. Like for an entire season I did this insanity. But that's what mattered was that I was there. They didn't care how I knew which stadium to show up at, you know? 

Speaker 1
No, I love that. It's it's that you were there, it's that you were present. Right, 

Speaker 2
Exactly. That I was there for every single one of those games and never missed a game. And, you know, but I could to, to be there and organize it all. There's not enough time in the day and, and I actually needed to earn money. 'cause if I'm flying every week to Chicago, you know, to go see a game that's not a small amount of money, you know? 

Speaker 1
Yes, absolutely. Hmm. Oh my 

Speaker 2
Goodness. Oh yeah. I find that the hiring an executive assistant personally, when you are a parent of children who are active and they're doing things is, I mean, by far the best hire you can make, I mean by far. Because you can actually then show up at a family dinner happily and help them with homework at night because you're not trying to answer all the insane emails from the school or figure out, you know, every login. I mean, oh my gosh, if I could tell you the number of logins, passwords, I was literally, I, I was like, Sandra, I can't handle this. Like, I cannot log into another school portal and figure out, I was like, every day send me a report of what their grades are, what their, I would get little like schedules of what was, but I didn't have to log into all of it myself, you know? 

Speaker 1
Yes. No, I even tell my friends, I'm like, look, you can get a va, like everybody can get a VA for, you know, six to $9 an hour overseas. You can get help with all of these things. And they're like, what? Yeah. Yes you can. 

Speaker 2
Absolutely. I mean, it's kind of life altering. 

Speaker 1
It is. And even the process of going through it, because some, some, you know, moms again have that guilt. They're like, well I can't outsource like managing my kids' schedule. And so it's then it then becomes a student of the art of letting go. 

Speaker 2
Oh yeah. 

Speaker 1
And looking in the mirror as you go to that, through that process and really digging deep about like, why don't you want to let go? What do you have to lose? But what do you have to gain? And seeing like, okay, I know this is gonna be hard. I know it's gonna be uncomfortable, but now that I know, then we can get through it. And then aside, you get more of what you actually want. 

Speaker 2
Well, and you think of all the time that gets wasted, like researching things. Do you know, like just figuring out what team should your child join for soccer? You can spend hours down rabbit holes of things and it's not actually that helpful. I mean, what you need is somebody to tell you, here are the eight teams, here are the costs, here are the practice schedules, here are the coaches, you know, here is my recommendation based on, you know, whatever criteria you've given them. And I mean, you can literally short circuit a 24 hour project down to like one or two hours and then you can spend that quality time researching maybe your top two. 

Maybe you even wanna pick up the phone and call somebody and really dig in and understand the philosophy of a particular coach or a team or whatever. You wouldn't have the time to do that if you're spending all this time just trying to figure out does it even work in your kids' school schedule? You know? 

Speaker 1
Yeah. There's this saying in business highest and best use of time. 

Speaker 2
Yeah. 

Speaker 1
And it is, it is so true whether people own a business or not. And I think that, you know, we've grown technology and information wise in the past 20 years than we have in the entire span of humankind. 

Speaker 2
Totally. 

Speaker 1
And I feel like we're finally stepping into this age where people are really, 'cause you know, we're coming out of information and option overload. Yeah. We are all paralyzed with news and software options and just all of the information that's being thrown at us. And I feel like we are finally stepping into the era of people recognizing highest and best use of your time and attention and delegating what needs to be delegated and saying no to what we need to say no to. Like, I recently turned off almost all of my notifications on my phone and I'm in this and look, that pisses people off too, but like, here's my theory, my time and attention is mine. And I don't want this device to be able to derail me from whatever or whoever I'm sitting in front of because I want it to be meaningful. 

Speaker 2
Yep. 

Speaker 1
Like right here in this podcast, I wanna pay attention to everything. I wanna be engaged with everything. And I think that that is a big takeaway as we wrap up here. Like really being protective and shameless and unapologetic 

Speaker 2
Yes. 

Speaker 1
In making the most of your time and attention and the people that you spend it with. 

Speaker 2
And I have to tell you, I am, I think of it even a little bit further, not just not having shame and actually having joy around what you're choosing to do. It is your life. You have one life on this earth, by all means. Live it how you want to live. I don't give a rat's behind what somebody else thinks about what I should do with my time. It's mine, it's my life. Like they're not living my life. And it, it just, and so I literally, if it does not bring me joy is not on my calendar. I mean, like, it goes bye-bye. 

And, and you know, that sounds a little bit selfish probably, but I don't care like it, it's my life. And if I decide I wanna spend my life doing joyful things, then that is how I'm gonna spend my life. 

Speaker 1
Yeah. And if you're not sold yet, keep in mind that no matter what you do or what you say, somebody's always not gonna like it. 

Speaker 2
Right. Right. I mean, 

Speaker 1
You can't win. 

Speaker 2
Yeah. Well, and I mean, the thought of even trying to please all the people is like, not even slightly on my radar. Do you know what I mean? Like there is no doubt that I anger people regularly, you know, like, but okay, I just have to know for me internally, like how do I treat all the humans I come in contact with? I can control that and I can control how I respond to people and the energy I bring to things. But whatever else they think, I mean, that's way beyond what I can control deal with. And, and it's not on my joy calendar. So, you know, and if it's not in my calendar, it is not happening. 

So, you know, it's just not there. And yeah, I think it's, I mean, it, it just, it kind of kills me when I see what women in particular go through and the guilt and the shame and the, you know, well this person says this and I'm just like, who cares? You know, like, just don't go down that rabbit hole. 

Speaker 1
No, you said it like, if you really sit down and think about what is truly in your control, not what you think or would like for it to be in your control. Like what you can truly control is very, very little. But when you laser focus and only focus on the things that you can control and you can master the art of letting go and saying no to the rest, it is so liberating. 

Speaker 2
Ugh, so liberating. I mean, so liberating. 

Speaker 1
Hmm. We cause a lot of this ourselves. 

Speaker 2
We do, we really do. I mean, I, I do think that handy mirror though is so important. 'cause you bring up that mirror and you ask yourself, did I show up in the way that I intended? Like, did I act like I intended to act? Did I act aligned with my values? If you can say yes to that, you know, in your interaction, I mean, great. You can put that handy dandy mirror away again and be like, okay, next thing you know. And, and, and then when you don't, then you're like, okay, let me figure out what was going on. You know, why did I not act in the way I intended? And then you can fix it, you know? 'cause if you get out that mirror, then you, you have that evidence right in front of you and it's like, oh, okay, let me fix this and apologize if need be. 

Whatever, you know, you might need to do. And then there you are going forward again. 

You know? But I think that's just life. 

Speaker 1
It's a cycle. And that's, that's, that's that. A forever student of life. Yep. Yes. 

Speaker 2
Yes. Hmm. It is, I think you're right. I mean, I'm gonna think about it now as a student with a mirror on the inside of my book. You know, because it's like you're learning and reflecting just constantly. 

Speaker 1
Yes, yes. And, and I have to say, I'm so glad that I was able to pin you down through your assistant because you like, 

For this conversation. Because I mean, Elise, you are doing amazing things in this space. You're such an inspiration. I love how you show up. I love how I talk to people personally who get that inspiration from you. And I also love your mission through your law firm and how you're doing it by, you know, empowering your people. Because leadership starts from the top and you're absolutely infusing all of these positive missions through your staff and through your families. And especially being somebody who has two different co-parents, two different totally situations. What you're doing through your firm is incredibly needed. 

And I know you guys are creating impact and you're an amazing person and I'm so glad that you came to the podcast. Thank you. 

Speaker 2
Well, I'm so grateful that you asked me. I love talking to you and I love the work you do. I mean, you know how much I love numbers and forecast and when I work with law firm owners who work with you, I'm like, yippee. 

I mean, because they understand their numbers and they really can dig in and they'll, when they ask questions, you know, they're like, well, I'll have to talk to my team. And I'm like, you do that Chelsea and your team. And, but it's great because I mean, bringing law firm owners some more peace of mind around their numbers, it literally is life changing. So they're not just like up at night with all this just spinning of, they have no idea what they're even spinning about. I'm like, yeah, we gotta get this figured out. And so I just love the work you do with law firms and I love that you, even though we're kind of jerks, 'cause we are, I do realize that. 

But you break through anyway and you found some of us are okay. 

Speaker 1
Yes. Aw, that makes my harm my heart warm because that's our goal is to demystify the numbers. Use it as a mirror. 

Speaker 2
Yep. 

Speaker 1
Numbers tell a story and push past that. So that's really good to hear you liked this episode. Be sure to show us some love by subscribing and turning on those notifications. You can find me on Instagram under the Money Whisper and also where we encourage you to contribute to join the conversation, ask questions and share your thoughts so we can create more episodes tailored exactly to what you wanna know about Money. I'm your host and your personal Money whisperer. Until next time, remember, it is always and never about the money.